Joey Faust perceives the trial by fire of our works as casting Christians into OUTER DARKNESS.  I was thinking of the trial by fire the other day in relationship to refining gold.  I was thinking of the fact that once we are saved, God wants us to become more like Jesus and there is a verse in Job who, one could say, endured more chastening than anyone known to man and yet he was the most Godly man of his day.  What does he say?

“Behold, I go forward, but he is not there; and backward, but I cannot perceive him: On the left hand, where he doth work, but I cannot behold him: he hideth himself on the right hand, that I cannot see him: But he knoweth the way that I take: when he hath tried me, I shall come forth as gold.” (Job 23:8-10)

Could we not easily say that the trial by fire before the Bema is more akin to God removing the chaff so that only gold remains of the works that we have done?  I have friends in the gold business and when they remove the oar from the mine, the first thing that happens is that the large rocks are crushed to make the ore like sand.  Then they spin the sand in a centrifuge to allow the “heavies” to move to the bottom and the lighter refuse fall off the top.  Next they do cyanide leaching to burn off the impurities and press the ore into “miners bars.”  The final step is the “trial by fire” which brings forth the pure end product while the impurities are scraped off the top leaving 999.9 pure gold.

My view is that God sees us as Justified IN CHRIST JESUS and wants to PURIFY US to come forth as gold.  Even though Job was the most Godly man in the world, yet God brought him through the most fire because at the end he would have the most gold of anyone alive.

Joey Faust knows not God, nor does he know the purpose of God.  I believe that God does the opposite of what Joey imagines even with the works  that are tried. Perhaps the ones with the most  trial by fire are the most Godly who will have the most “gold” in the end, not the unfaithful as Joey postulates.  Where Joey wants to think that a godly man like Job will not endure hardly any trial by fire, yet the Bible shows just the opposite.  A well known Christian in the past said, “…sometimes God chooses to keep his finest servants in chains….”  It is hardly an indictment on the less faithful that causes God to act thus.  Rather it is his goal of bringing out the gold, thus the trial by fire.

(Update 5/1/2014 – I was contacted this week by someone who was a member of Joey’s church for almost 20 years.  He said that as a result of the “Kingdom” teaching and also another book, men are abusing their wives.  THE ROD OF GOD has permeated into the homes of members so that the “rod of the husband” has been the way to keep control.  I was told today that at least 15 marriages have broken up because of the total control that Joey Faust gains on his church members even to the point of writing down their secrets in counseling and then trying to blackmail them into submission by threatening to expose them.  It was also noted that Joey Faust has no clear testimony of being born again.  His knowledge and personal walk with God are exactly like the verse in the Bible in James 2:19 where devils believe and tremble.  Only Satan himself could have conceived of this heresy of pulling Christians into Hell which is not temporary but eternal and is prepared – not for Christians – only for the devil and his angels.  The “disinterested benevolence” spoken of in this online book is strangely missing in those involved in the Kingdom Exclusion cult.)

God’s goal is not to punish us for not being over-comers, but to work on our lives to keep us from falling and to bring us faultless to His presence.

“Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,”  (Jude 1:24)

He wants to present his bride (His Church) without spot and works in the lives of Christians to bring that to pass.

“That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word, That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.” (Ephesians 5:26-27)

Any man that would torture his wife for a thousand years would be criminally insane.  Joey Faust makes God into a being that is criminally insane for wanting to torture Christians who have already had Christ pay for their sins but yet wants to torture them rather than refine, sanctify, and cleanse them.

It is impossible to send a Christian into OUTER DARKNESS because when we get get saved we are placed IN CHRIST.

That means that  we can’t go anywhere that Jesus does not go and if we were to be cast into OUTER DARKNESS, then it must be that Jesus Christ is cast there because we can’t go anywhere outside of Christ and wherever Christ goes we go.  Also, if Jesus is not cast into outer darkness then neither are we cast into OUTER DARKNESS since we are IN CHRIST JESUS.

“But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:”  (1 Corinthians 1:30)
“For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.”  (Colossians 3:3)

Joey Faust must separate the Christian who is IN CHRIST from being IN CHRIST in order to cast them into OUTER DARNESS but since God says in Romans 8 that NOTHING CAN SEPARATE US FROM THE LOVE OF CHRIST WHICH IS IN CHRIST JESUS, then Jesus would need to go into OUTER DARKNESS to suffer under JOEY FAUST in order to punish unfaithful Christians since we are all IN CHRIST.  Thus, the whole theory falls dead simply because Joey Faust does not have a clue of what it means to be a Christian which includes being IN CHRIST.  For an illustration of this truth, please take a look at the chart below:

When we get saved we believe INTO Jesus Christ and as such we lose our identity in regard to sin.  God looks as us as being IN CHRIST and as such sees only HIS RIGHTEOUSNESS.  That is why we are considered justified or made just as if we never sinned.  The most famous verse in the Bible talks about “whosoever believeth in him” where that word “in” is the Greek word “eis” which actually is more accurately translated “INTO.”  So, when we are saved we are placed INTO Jesus Christ.  This means that it is impossible for God to send any Christian into outer darkness without sending Jesus Christ there since we are considered “IN CHRIST.”

“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in (into) him should not perish, but have everlasting life.”  (John 3:16)

“But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:”  (1 Corinthians 1:30)

Those that God has put “into” Christ are special and God has no intention of disturbing the “rest” of the people of God but rather he considers them JEWELS that he wants to work on during this life to bring out the beauty in them.

“And they shall be mine, saith the LORD of hosts, in that day when I make up my jewels; and I will spare them, as a man spareth his own son that serveth him.  (Malachi 3:17)
“And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The LORD is my God.”  (Zechariah 13:9)

The relationship of God to Christians is the relationship of husband to wife, not of judge to criminals as Joey Faust claims.  It is a love relationship, not a judicial relationship.  The judicial relationship was settled with the death and resurrection of Christ.

“Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it; That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word, That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish. So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.”  (Ephesians 5:25-28)

God is speaking about a love relationship.  If a man loves his wife, he loves himself.  If a man sends his wife into OUTER DARKNESS as Joey Faust says, then he sends himself into outer darkness.  It would mean sending God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit into DARKNESS if God were to follow the JOEY FAUST SATANIC HERESY.

The truth is that the very name of God and the very character of God is one of love, “God is Love.”  That word love is, as stated in other parts of this site, DISINTERESTED BENEVOLENCE or Agape Love.  It means that God loves because he sees the INTRINSIC VALUE of the object, you and me and he loves with no expectation of any payback on our part.  This means also, that the payment of Jesus is sufficient for all our sins, or any other failure that Joey Faust claims we need to pay.  I love the song, JESUS PAID IT ALL, ALL TO HIM I OWE, SIN HAD LEFT A CRIMSON STAIN, HE WASHED IT WHITE AS SNOW.

The goal of God, when he brings his beloved JEWELS, his BRIDE, his BORN AGAIN ONES, his JUSTIFIED ONES, his SAVED ONES who are IN CHRIST to HIMSELF is merely to bring them as pure as possible and get rid of all the rough edges, the chaff, the impurities, or anything that makes us less like the Image of Jesus Christ so that all that anyone in the whole universe can see is the same thing that God sees.  He sees sinless, purified, justified, holy, righteous, sanctified, redeemed sinners that have nothing that they can do to inherit eternal life but have received his free gift and thus are acceptable in the beloved.

“Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ: According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved. In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace; Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence; Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself: That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him: In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will: That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ. In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.” (Ephesians 1:3-14)

The words that are in bold print show the purpose of God.  It is not, as Joey Faust says, TO VINDICATE THE JUSTICE OF GOD, but to make us ACCEPTED IN THE BELOVED,  to gather together in one all things in Christ, to obtain our inheritance, all of which show that the goal of God is our best end.  It also says that we are sealed by the Holy Spirit.  This is called THE ERNEST.  It is like the down payment on a home.  God is giving us a down payment on our presentation as the PURCHASED POSSESSION in heaven.  God would no more burn us in OUTER DARKNESS after putting down EARNEST MONEY than a home owner would burn the house down which he had just purchased with a costly price.  No one, not even God, would do such a foolish thing with something that cost the very life of his only Son.

What God sees is GOLD, JEWELS, ACCEPTED PRE-DESTINED SAINTS, PURCHASED POSSESSION,  A LOVING BRIDE, all of which he only wants to have with him and wants to make them the very best redeemed souls that will spend eternity with Him.